Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 37 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next
  Print view Previous topic | Next topic 
Author Message
 Post subject: Siege grouping(partyes)
PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 2:47 pm 
Forum Troll
User avatar

Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2008 4:40 pm
Posts: 12869
now this is first topic here;]and as it says-frouping during sieges!
while in sieges we have multiply partyes right?whole ally is there and some other friendly clans..how do we group?wich classes do we combine?
ill try to start(dont u dare to flame on me niggaz!!!)
My idea is having small and fast moving groups-full partyes are allawayes slow,some1 panix,all die..3-4 ppl in pt is pretty nice group with firing power and also-->they are few so they can comunicate faster(what i mean?-->3 pt members vote..not full pt->decisionin faster=faster reacting the changing enviornment..i hope u get me)..imo any group if its possible should have a sws or a bd..ull say now;"bigger groups need only 1 bd/sws but if we have 2 groups of 4 ppl instead of 1 group of 8,we need 2 bds/swss"
BUT this way we are much faster and flexible..even if u dont have a bd in most partyes when the enemy comes are separate(not at 1 piece)..so isnt it better having 10 small pts all around..we dont stand like sheeps together so we are harder to be targeted..if u see 1 big spider..u smash it fast but if u see 20 small ants u start aiming,they run away,they come again etc etc

thats my opinion(u can edit,say ur own opinion but i remind im not best siege maker..)So how do u think we should make our pts?5 archers in place or 3 archers 2 tanks or 3 archers 1 tank 1 healer if its possible?
imo best is the combination of all forces--assassins(daggers),tanks,nukers/bow masters and maybe healer/other supporter
as i hope u all know we cant just order 100 healers for the rb so the healers are never enough:(so imo pt of 5 max would look great like this
1 archer,1mage,1tank,1bd(to support bot-nuker and archer) and if its possible healer..the tank can be made by tanker class(sk,tk,pa,da) or "fat class" like destro or glad(shitloadz of hp/cp and some firing power)

or another option is using archers combined with a summoner..wo0t ps would be great..the cubics will trigger often and the ps is able to use the fat summon(shade or what?dont remember name) to tank or to heal..both roles are able to be played by the ps.same good choice would be warlock,elem summoner-both have good buffs and cubics(gift of seraphim,blessing of queen etc)
so what about the pts rushing the castle?what about full pts here?if we defend our castle outside or we are attackers as i said imo would be great if we have small fast moving pts(if u comunicate thrue teamspeak or smth like that it would look even better).but what about rushing the castle rooms?ofcourse tanks are able to stand much longer but still when u have 3-4 DDs on u ur life aint be very long..ofcourse a healr would help much but another DD is able to target ur healer and to finish him fast..what do u think about this?


Reply with quote
Top
 OfflineProfile  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 3:29 pm 
Count

Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2007 4:45 pm
Posts: 978
Location: Arad, Romania
OL / DD / Nuker / Hybrid parties.

Best setup for archer pt is 3 archers /bd/sws/cov'er/wk(or another archer)/cardi/EE. MA = the one w/ no lags. All near MA on battlefield , even PL, so every1 can get "disco" and stay together. All DD's are arranged last in party.
If wall shot exist name 3 ppl from entire ally to be MA's, and make macros with asissts.
Wall shot it's really cool/annoyng on castles like Goddard/Schuttgart or Rune.
Stay all together on battlefield and remember that your CL must have maximum protection. Stay near your flag, or let 2 partyes including Hybrid ones with tanks in it.
You can have 2 partyes wich will be in moving always. You can have non-factors characters on box , near castle, to make some ideeas.
OL partyes should have rechargers/healers/bd/sws/ES
Nuker partyes : EE,SE,bd,sws,cov'er
Hybrid ones, you know what i mean, maybe CL can stay in one like that , with plenty of tanks.And last thing take a crafter too.

And we're talking about sieges wich provides perfect partyes, not some 4ppl partyes because they won't have the chance to do somethink, even if they are 10 partyes like that.


Reply with quote
Top
 OfflineProfile  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 3:35 pm 
Duke
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 14, 2007 1:06 pm
Posts: 4879
Location: Cluj-Napoca, Romania
If you ask me, the best parties are when combined with the same class. For example make a small dagger party, with 4 daggers, not more. Add a healer, a bd, a sws, and 2 tanks (very important). I've seen this at work. One of the tanks get loose from the group, so it will attract attention. Bishop - sharp eye and intuition. At some point, the other tank is in the group, but in range to cast aggro. As soon as any melee aproaches, both tanks use aggro in a synchronization and pull the target. At that point, daggers launch their attacks.

Instead of daggers you may assemble archers, it should be more efficient.


Another idea is to make a dagger party, a scouting dagger party. While the fight is in full plains, they get behind enemy lines and wait for someone to separate. At that point, 1 of them may cause a distraction, something i like to call 'false failed attack'. He goes onto that mage, being sure the mage sees him. When the mage nukes, he retreats, the mage will surely come, because he thinks he's safe behind his team. That's when hell breaks free.



Remember, this is from the attacking side.

_________________
<reddit rando> wrote:
What off platform you dog? Off platform hasn't been a thing in years this game is only playable using Java and if you believe otherwise you're too stupid because every server you played has been Java

fosho!


Reply with quote
Top
 OfflineProfile  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 4:01 pm 
Duke
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2007 11:31 pm
Posts: 2658
ok, nice guide, original ideas...

but what about when u defend?

I've been in some sieges, and i can say that the best is stay inside the castle. Yes, not like most clans do, I've seens both methods (rushing the attackers and waiting for them to rush) and I can say that pure defense is the best way. Forget about the old saying "Attack is the best deffense", in sieges that doesnt apply.

Now, u will want to use strategical points around the castle:

Many castles are near rivers, use it as a border, dont stand to close to the river or archers will be able to shoot u from the other side. Just wait there and if someone crosses, hes dead. U will need some archers, i go full pt's (not to arhue with u Gods3nd). U should look for some archers, all HEs make a snipe line. For support do the usual: BD+SWS+WK+bish. Dont waste party slots with buffers, use a boxed PP/WC, or ask someone to buff u.
Nukers should stay inside the castle, they got fast killing skills, so if some enemy party manages to sneak up to the castle u can end it right there.

Other thing is to use bridges, mountains, hide behind trees and rocks (robin hood style), dont forget to have ALL ur parties with good support, thats a must!



OK, but sometimes u cant win with this strategy, I've senn that too. What shall u do?
The only way to conquer a castle is to cast the Seal. This is where u do what I call "Castle UD". This means having archers and nukers inside the castle at that wall where it makes some sort of circle (for Oren, Gludio, Dion, Innadril and Giran) and meele at ground level. That way you can bomb the enemy from far and catch them with deadly hits from behind while they are distracted. This strategy is used when the enemy enters the castle throught the gates.

When they rush by the lateral walls, theres a simple thing to do. U get out by that tiny opening at the rear of the castle and u catch them from behind ONCE THEY ARE INSIDE THE CASTLE and remember not to let them see u do this.

Now, theres a more desperate Castle UD. This can be done even with one party (i tested it). U get ur asses inside the seal room and u cover every wall, every inch of the room. U will once more want to have meeles at ground level, hiding around the corner and archers/nukers on some upper postion (like in aden or elmore castles). Thats the most effective way to deffend when u fight small groups of enemies. Ofc it wont work if u face huge allies that will zerg u in 1 second.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now this requires a lot of planing and coordination. This usualy cant be done without teamspeak or ventrilo and without a very good explanation in the ally/clan forum or some ally reunion.
U have to plan the parties before the siege and everyone must know his job and position on the battlefield.

When the siege starts, the parties must be in place and ready to roll. This means that u must have one meele party behind every single entrance, one snipe line on every single hallway. U must have a tank here and there, mainly behind doors, that will spam hate aura while in UD. These tanks MUST have one private healer and one private recharger.

The base of this plan is so that everyone backs everyone else. While some are covering one door, the other cover the other door, and other cover those covering the doors.

Also, one OL party would be nice. For example, one near gates/walls and one inside the inner castle. Those parties would be: 3 OLs and 3-4 rechargers, 1 BD, 1SwS and 1 ES(optional). If u dont have many OLs, u can have 1-2 OLs, 4 rechargers, 1 SwS, 1 BD and 1 ES and bishop(optional).
Just spam CP when u see the enemy rushing. Another good thing is to have all OLs lvl 80 (FoI). When the enemy rushes ONE OL use FoI. When its over and if the enemy is still rushing, another one use it, and so on.


Its hard to make, I said that. Its hard to get those many supporters, i know. Most allies focus on firepower and most players want to "p0wn" and dont give a shit about support classes.


Reply with quote
Top
 OfflineProfile  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 4:16 pm 
Forum Troll
User avatar

Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2008 4:40 pm
Posts: 12869
KentZ0ne wrote:
OL / DD / Nuker / Hybrid parties.

Best setup for archer pt is 3 archers /bd/sws/cov'er/wk(or another archer)/cardi/EE. MA = the one w/ no lags. All near MA on battlefield , even PL, so every1 can get "disco" and stay together. All DD's are arranged last in party.
If wall shot exist name 3 ppl from entire ally to be MA's, and make macros with asissts.
Wall shot it's really cool/annoyng on castles like Goddard/Schuttgart or Rune.
Stay all together on battlefield and remember that your CL must have maximum protection. Stay near your flag, or let 2 partyes including Hybrid ones with tanks in it.
You can have 2 partyes wich will be in moving always. You can have non-factors characters on box , near castle, to make some ideeas.
OL partyes should have rechargers/healers/bd/sws/ES
Nuker partyes : EE,SE,bd,sws,cov'er
Hybrid ones, you know what i mean, maybe CL can stay in one like that , with plenty of tanks.And last thing take a crafter too.

And we're talking about sieges wich provides perfect partyes, not some 4ppl partyes because they won't have the chance to do somethink, even if they are 10 partyes like that.


ok i get it.. but why the hell u think small fast "scout" pts cant do nothing?i dont agree..


Reply with quote
Top
 OfflineProfile  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 5:37 pm 
Count

Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2007 4:45 pm
Posts: 978
Location: Arad, Romania
What you do against well grouped 50-150 ppl with those small parties?. Die.

And razveck , at the begining you need to take all your allies outside of the castle and try kill their flags , and fight your enemyes so they couldn't kill castle units.
Because if they kill all of them , if you or your allies die, you need to stay in that castle room where you spawn after death for 8minutes.
If they don't kill any castle unit, you guys will respawn after 30seconds+. In that way if enemyes will enter in crystal room, it's harder for them to cast that Seal, because you guys will keep spawning.

What you said, it's allright , but at the end of the siege. Until then you have enough time to defend the castle from outside. Afterall a siege last for 2hr's.


Reply with quote
Top
 OfflineProfile  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 6:01 pm 
Duke
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2007 11:31 pm
Posts: 2658
KentZ0ne wrote:
What you do against well grouped 50-150 ppl with those small parties?. Die.

And razveck , at the begining you need to take all your allies outside of the castle and try kill their flags , and fight your enemyes so they couldn't kill castle units.
Because if they kill all of them , if you or your allies die, you need to stay in that castle room where you spawn after death for 8minutes.
If they don't kill any castle unit, you guys will respawn after 30seconds+. In that way if enemyes will enter in crystal room, it's harder for them to cast that Seal, because you guys will keep spawning.

What you said, it's allright , but at the end of the siege. Until then you have enough time to defend the castle from outside. Afterall a siege last for 2hr's.


That is the normal prespective of a siege.

My point is: dont even let them summon a flag


Reply with quote
Top
 OfflineProfile  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 6:05 pm 
Count

Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2007 4:45 pm
Posts: 978
Location: Arad, Romania
After a time , i will let them , and then kill their flags, i'll take 300 CRP/flag :D


Reply with quote
Top
 OfflineProfile  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 6:16 pm 
Forum Troll
User avatar

Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2008 4:40 pm
Posts: 12869
but who said small groups wont be well organized


Reply with quote
Top
 OfflineProfile  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 6:36 pm 
Count

Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2007 4:45 pm
Posts: 978
Location: Arad, Romania
Rush Zerg anytime.
Even if you try play with them , you will die eventually.


Reply with quote
Top
 OfflineProfile  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 7:18 pm 
Count
User avatar

Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2007 10:44 am
Posts: 909
Icarus wrote:
If you ask me, the best parties are when combined with the same class. For example make a small dagger party, with 4 daggers, not more. Add a healer, a bd, a sws, and 2 tanks (very important). I've seen this at work. One of the tanks get loose from the group, so it will attract attention. Bishop - sharp eye and intuition. At some point, the other tank is in the group, but in range to cast aggro. As soon as any melee aproaches, both tanks use aggro in a synchronization and pull the target. At that point, daggers launch their attacks.

Instead of daggers you may assemble archers, it should be more efficient.


Another idea is to make a dagger party, a scouting dagger party. While the fight is in full plains, they get behind enemy lines and wait for someone to separate. At that point, 1 of them may cause a distraction, something i like to call 'false failed attack'. He goes onto that mage, being sure the mage sees him. When the mage nukes, he retreats, the mage will surely come, because he thinks he's safe behind his team. That's when hell breaks free.



Remember, this is from the attacking side.


daggers can't do shit at sieges especially when attacking rofl , maybe they are fast at breaking the castle doors and destroying the life crystal ut you can't go at siege with dagger partyies

archers should be more efficient than daggers ? dude in sieges archers are everything you can't attack a castle without archers party

my vision for perfect attackers group :

Attackers will need to make many rush inside the castle to avoid the ridiculous damage from the archers on the wall .For that you need 2 OL's for flames of invincibility (30 secs of inv to the all clan) and continuous VOP and ofc for CP healing , this i think it's the most important.

3 parties of archers : WC , WK , bd , sws , WK is not so important but if the archers assist them self they can do dmg :)

1st nuker party : OL, Necro , sps , sps , SE , bd , sws , sorc and EE ofcourse :P . i think any clan should get a necro for mass mage bane and mass warrior bane it's fucking great , mass slow , mass gloom -> OL's seals land more often -> fucking ownage and ofc the sps's and the sorc have aoe attacks <3 them

2nd nuker pt : OL , necro , sph , sph , sph , EE , ES (elemental summoner) , SE. Necro for gloom again , spellhowlers for dmg , EE for pow and clarity recharges heals , ES for the pink horse , SE for empower recharges and heals :-P


bu i don't think any clan can make so perfect parties , maybe the old ones which have old players and everything they need

about the rush thing ... well hmmm many ppl ask why ?! well i think it's the best for screwing for the defender's strategies , the HE's in snipe will stay on the wall for a while :> things will be fucked up if u manage to destroy inside castle's gates a second rush inside the castle will be hard to defend .

P.S : my leader always brings dwarfs to destroy teh walls


Reply with quote
Top
 OfflineProfile  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 7:25 pm 
Baron
User avatar

Joined: Sat Mar 22, 2008 2:46 am
Posts: 229
Location: Bulgaria
Best thing at sieges - Get as many ppl as u can. No point in building "the perfect party". Everything is important.

_________________
Image

- Why do you smoke anyways?
- Fuck you, dude.
-------------------------------
"- Do you know what nemezis means? A righteous infliction of retribution, manifested by an appropriate agent. Personified in this case, by an horrible cunt - me."


Reply with quote
Top
 OfflineProfile  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 8:41 pm 
Duke
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 14, 2007 1:06 pm
Posts: 4879
Location: Cluj-Napoca, Romania
WaZaWanGa wrote:
Icarus wrote:
If you ask me, the best parties are when combined with the same class. For example make a small dagger party, with 4 daggers, not more. Add a healer, a bd, a sws, and 2 tanks (very important). I've seen this at work. One of the tanks get loose from the group, so it will attract attention. Bishop - sharp eye and intuition. At some point, the other tank is in the group, but in range to cast aggro. As soon as any melee aproaches, both tanks use aggro in a synchronization and pull the target. At that point, daggers launch their attacks.

Instead of daggers you may assemble archers, it should be more efficient.


Another idea is to make a dagger party, a scouting dagger party. While the fight is in full plains, they get behind enemy lines and wait for someone to separate. At that point, 1 of them may cause a distraction, something i like to call 'false failed attack'. He goes onto that mage, being sure the mage sees him. When the mage nukes, he retreats, the mage will surely come, because he thinks he's safe behind his team. That's when hell breaks free.



Remember, this is from the attacking side.


daggers can't do shit at sieges especially when attacking rofl , maybe they are fast at breaking the castle doors and destroying the life crystal ut you can't go at siege with dagger partyies

archers should be more efficient than daggers ? dude in sieges archers are everything you can't attack a castle without archers party

my vision for perfect attackers group :

Attackers will need to make many rush inside the castle to avoid the ridiculous damage from the archers on the wall .For that you need 2 OL's for flames of invincibility (30 secs of inv to the all clan) and continuous VOP and ofc for CP healing , this i think it's the most important.

3 parties of archers : WC , WK , bd , sws , WK is not so important but if the archers assist them self they can do dmg :)

1st nuker party : OL, Necro , sps , sps , SE , bd , sws , sorc and EE ofcourse :P . i think any clan should get a necro for mass mage bane and mass warrior bane it's fucking great , mass slow , mass gloom -> OL's seals land more often -> fucking ownage and ofc the sps's and the sorc have aoe attacks <3 them

2nd nuker pt : OL , necro , sph , sph , sph , EE , ES (elemental summoner) , SE. Necro for gloom again , spellhowlers for dmg , EE for pow and clarity recharges heals , ES for the pink horse , SE for empower recharges and heals :-P


bu i don't think any clan can make so perfect parties , maybe the old ones which have old players and everything they need

about the rush thing ... well hmmm many ppl ask why ?! well i think it's the best for screwing for the defender's strategies , the HE's in snipe will stay on the wall for a while :> things will be fucked up if u manage to destroy inside castle's gates a second rush inside the castle will be hard to defend .

P.S : my leader always brings dwarfs to destroy teh walls

Daggers are an important part of the siege. They are scouts and they massacre when the enemies get inside. In the plain field, they need very good strategies to kill someone, so they're not 100% important. But archers are as important as daggers overall looking. You can't exactly siege without daggers, because inside you may see a big surprise. Daggers are exceptional for hit-around-the-wall. Appear, hit, hit, dissapear, it's like the mage was never there.

How does 6 daggers + celestial shield sound? Seems to me a party of mages dead in under 10 seconds.

_________________
<reddit rando> wrote:
What off platform you dog? Off platform hasn't been a thing in years this game is only playable using Java and if you believe otherwise you're too stupid because every server you played has been Java

fosho!


Reply with quote
Top
 OfflineProfile  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 12, 2008 7:10 am 
Marquis
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2008 7:22 am
Posts: 1309
daggers = assasions
they can easily skip throuh the defences and kill people then vanish :)


Reply with quote
Top
 OfflineProfile  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 12, 2008 8:52 am 
Duke
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 14, 2007 1:06 pm
Posts: 4879
Location: Cluj-Napoca, Romania
Btw, waza i read your post again.

WaZaWanGa wrote:
daggers can't do shit at sieges especially when attacking rofl , maybe they are fast at breaking the castle doors and destroying the life crystal ut you can't go at siege with dagger partyies

No shit... I think destroes in frenzy are mainly the ones knocking doors off.

_________________
<reddit rando> wrote:
What off platform you dog? Off platform hasn't been a thing in years this game is only playable using Java and if you believe otherwise you're too stupid because every server you played has been Java

fosho!


Reply with quote
Top
 OfflineProfile  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 37 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next

All times are UTC + 2 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  


Contact | Cookies policy